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by elkahna from Hillsborough Co, FL

Last Post 9 days, 5 hours Ago


Today is 05242008 and as I do most days, I read the Tampa Tribune.  Some days I wish I didn't. Today in the "Letters to the Editor" a large segment appeared entitled "The Ability of Same-Sex Couples to Marry Is seen as a Civil Right" I read the letters with interest and dismay as I read the letters.

One letter writer agreed that same sex marriage weren't what the writer particularly agreed with but agreed with the California Supreme Court in striking down a state ban and allowing same sex marriage in California. The writer aluded to the founding fathers fleeing evil persecution and intolerance, saying that today, right -wing religious fanatics have perverted the gospel of Christ.

Another writer said that there was nothing "immoral" about the lifestlye or same sex marriages between consenting adults and that same sex couples want to enjoy the same status  that momogamous heterosexual adults enjoy, legally and socially.

As in all my other scribblings in this forum I will not beat around the bush but get to the point.  In an earlier post I made titled, "Lord of All or not at all" a primary distinction is made. It has nothing to do with being a right wing fanatic or perverting the Gospel of Christ.  God loves everyone equally, so much so that He sent His own Son to die for all, shedding His own precious blood and forfieting His life that we might live. God nor Christians hate "gay" people. God loves everyone and we are told to love our neighbor as ourselves. That said, God nor Christians hate people. God hates sin. His Word says so. You either believe the Bible is the inspired complete Word of God or you dont. There is no middle ground. Our opinions on these facts do not matter. Even if you deny God, He still is and only what He thinks will matter. The simple truth is that if you do not believe that the Bible is God's inspired and complete Word you might as well stop reading here because the rest will not matter to you (at least in this life)  We are told to hate sin. All the scripture I reference will be from the King James Version but you can read any version you like as the meaning does not change just the readability.  

In I Corinthians Chap 6 vers 9 we are told "...Be not deceived...  The complete verse goes like this, "Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolators, nor adulterers, nor effeminate (footnote: perverts & homosexuals) ..... shall inherit the kingdom of God" The foot note is not mine but that written in the KJV of the Bible I am using for reference.

Marriage is an institution that was instituted by God Himself. In Genesis Chapter 2 vs 18 the Lord God said, "It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him (foot note: helper fit for him)

Genesis chapter 2 vs 21 thru 25 ( you can look these up and read for yourself to make sure I am accurate) God caused a deep sleep to fall on Adam and took one of his ribs (footnote says "sides") and made a woman and brought her to the man. Adam said that she was "bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh and that she should be called woman. A man shall leave his father and mother and cleave to his wife and they two shall be one flesh. Thus was marriage instituted by God and the first one was performed by God himself when He presented the man with the woman. God did not bring Adam another man nor did He form Eve and then bring her another woman.

We move on now to Romans Chapter 1 (again you will have to look these references up if you don't believe I'm accurate)  where we are told man began to do all sorts of terrible things and that the wrath of God is against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men. Men worshipped gods made with hands and they did not glorify the true God but became, "(vs 21) "...vain in their imaginations and their foolish heart was darkened. VS 22  "Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools..."

Here we go to the meat and potatoes of the issue.  Romans Chapter 1 begin at vs 24 thru 32 (Look these up and read them for yourselves if you think I am inaccurate) The Bible says that ,"God gave them over to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts to dishonor their own bodies between themselves..."   The fact is that they changed the truth of God into a lie and worshipped the creature more than the Creator.

The following is what the Bible says about same sex relations. I am simply passing on information:

ROM 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

ROM 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

ROM 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

ROM 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

ROM 1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

ROM 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

ROM 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

These are not the words of some "right wing religious fanatic" but simply the words of the Bible.  As I said in the beginning, if you don't believe the Bible is the inspired Word of God and is His completed work, then you will disagree with this scribbling vehemently and lump the writer into the can with all the other "fanatics".

It does not matter how acceptible these issues have become in society in America or the world today. They are still wrong and not ordained of God. God does not hate those who participate in same sex issues nor do I. He loves everyone but we are still required to as lovingly as possible show when something is contrary to God's Word and "marriage" of same sex couples is not ordained of Him and it is absolutely not  "A Perversion of the Gospel" as many who approve of these issues seem to think when followers of Christ say what the Word says. For I am not ashamed of the Gospel of Christ for it is the power of God unto salvation.

These scribblings are not those of some "right wing religious fanatic" but of someone who loves the Word of God and the Lord Jesus and hopes all will come to that saving knowledge. I know that ,"...judge not, that ye be not judged..." is going to come so I head it off with this. We cannot pick and choose the verses of the Word we like and cast aside the rest. The old covenant was completed and fulfilled in the Savior Jesus and the new covenant is His blood to salvation. I am glad that we live under "grace" thats undeserved favor, rather than the law. As my first post says He is either "Lord of All or not at all"

Be Blessed

elkahna

 

 

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Vittorio read my blog view my photos
May 27, 2008 | 2:17 PM

Greetings from Dayton Ohio. I pray I get back to the South where I belong soon.

Are you against the legal recognition of same sex marriage? If so, can you tell me why without referring to the Bible?

elkahna read my blog
May 27, 2008 | 3:08 PM

Hey Vittorio

Dayton Ohio??? What are you doing all the way up there? Did you lose something? :-) Really, Now back to the question. I may can answer without referring to the Bible, however, my friend you must realize even if you don't understand (yet) that my whole life and existence is founded in the Lordship of Jesus Christ to the glory of God the Father. I live for, love and worship completely the Living Triune God.

More to follow

elkahna

elkahna read my blog
May 27, 2008 | 3:22 PM

I do oppose same sex "marriage" and civil unions on the same level. The main reason mammals and other animals come together is procreation. I am not delving into bacteria, asexual paramecium, fishes or cellular division ect. Most animals in fact, with a few exceptions (lions and herd animals) remain apart except to mate. Being very simplistic. Two male grizzlys dont cohabitate or live together happily for life. I know you know where that is going. In a short answer it is not recognized in the animal kingdom and only man who is supposed to be more intelligent and have reasoning ability and speech decided to come up with these things that fly in the face of nature. Thats about as good as it gets without referring to the Bible. (more to come)

elkahna

elkahna read my blog
May 28, 2008 | 2:56 PM

Hey Vittorio

Sorry I had to run without finishing my thought. Computer coughed (WTVT site maintenance)

Other than what I said above it is impossible for me to answer without the Word of God. I believe that God is the Creator and it begins in Genesis, " In the beginning, God..." He did it all and nothing was made without Him and consists because of Him. He created male of the dust and female of the man. She was formed as a perfect helpmeet for the man. God married them. There are no monkeys in our family tree so evolution from slime to man is out too. I never much thought about it but, Yep, I guess I'm a creationist and thank God for it. I really have no desire to forrage outside the teachings of the Bible so at this point question answered as best as I possibly could.

elkahna <

aschelan read my blog view my photos
May 29, 2008 | 8:03 PM

It is not my place to judge, so what ever a person chooses to do with their life is between themselves and their Creator. I try very hard to live by the Golden Rule, regardless of any personal conflicts in my beliefs. Yet, I have often wondered if same sex relationships weren't Gods way of controlling the continual over-population of our world. I do not mean to insult you, but as I see it, it is the perfect birth control.

elkahna read my blog
May 30, 2008 | 1:14 PM

Hey aschelan

I very much appreciate you reading the blog and your comment. I absolutely am not insulted. As my profile says I am passionate about God and enjoy CLEAN, good spirited and varying debate. Can I ask of you if you have read the first post, "Lord of All or not at all"? If you haven't would you do that and then let me know what you think and your preceptions of the info there? Again, thanks for the read and your input.

elkahna

thebradleys read my blog
May 30, 2008 | 4:14 PM

Lev 20:13 "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death."

1 Cor 6:9 "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals"

Am I the only one having a hard time reconciling God's love of everyone equally to some pretty harsh sentences (death and condemnation to hell) that are a little less than loving and forgiving for those who commit certain acts...?

aschelan read my blog view my photos
May 31, 2008 | 8:27 PM

Elkahna,
I did read it, There are two things about me that I will state before I make a comment- 1) I was raised Agnostic and did not join any organized religion until well into my thirties, until then I had studied many different view point, everything from Wiccan to Taoism. 2) Even before joining my Church, I lived my life according to the Golden Rule.
Mother Teresa said it beautifully when she said "If you take the time to judge people, you don't have the time to love them."

I still stand by my comment that a homosexual person has only to answer to his or her Creator. And that in some bizarre way it is a form of birth control. Is that 100% Christian Correct-- Probably not, but niether or the people who are against abortian for religious reason, but for the Death penalty. I am human, and inherently flawed.
I do enjoy your post, keeping me on my toes with looking up verses.

Vittorio read my blog view my photos
Jun 3, 2008 | 8:50 AM

I suppose I was in Dayton because I lost my mind. I forgot how good we have it here in Dixie until I dealt with those up North.

Sorry to burst your buble but "lower" forms of life do have sexual contact within gender. Last night my female terrier actually mounted my female cat! So lotsa stuff does, indeed, go on within the animal kingdom of which we are part.

I DO have a problem with a God who loves us all but condemns some to everlasting suffering for being themselves or not agreeing with others. We have but one commandment; Harm None. Works for me.

So much for morality. Shouldn't same sex couples have access to the same benefits (and penalties) of those in conventional relationships? How does their lifestyle affest you personally?

I support your right to disagree with their choices but not to change their lives. Blessed Be.

elkahna read my blog
Jun 3, 2008 | 1:44 PM

Hello All

Hey Vittorio glad you are back. I did wonder if you got lost :-) aschelan makes an excellent point in that a person has only to answer to their Creator. I agree with that wholeheartedly. I judge no man. Judgement is reserved unto Christ. My brother Vittorio, God is a big God and he can handle any problem you have with Him but your issues will not alter His Word. All I do is put the Word out there as He gives me opportunity and encourage all to come to Christ and live according to that word (more to follow)

elkahna read my blog
Jun 3, 2008 | 1:50 PM

Continued from above

Everyone has to make their own free will choice as to what they will do with Jesus and the Word of God.That includes ALL OF THE WORD, not just the parts you agree with. He still loves you and me even if we displease Him. But what will matter is if he sees the blood of His son that has washed away our sins when we stand before Him at that moment He will still love us but He will be righteous judge. He cannot look upon sin. He does classify what we are discussing here as sin. He loves all who practice it but He cannot accept anything that is contrary to the Word. Its your choice, He is either Lord of ALL or not at all.

Words to contemplate got to run for now

elkahna

RandyLoo read my blog view my photos
Jun 3, 2008 | 6:07 PM

You guys know far more than me so don't ask me to get any scripture out, but that one comment you posed Aschelon about homosexuality being Gods way of birth control seems way over the top and more like a cop out on a humanistic level. If you believe in God wouldn't you believe he has the universe under control, including its' population? That sort of reminds me of the cop out anthropologists use when they try to come up with an answer for men who commit adultery, they say in the beginning males just mated with many females this was natures way of populating and it is still a factor in all male genes.
I must say I have never heard that birth control argument before.

aschelan read my blog view my photos
Jun 3, 2008 | 8:26 PM

Not a cop out, like I said originally, just a bizarre thought. I could as easy flip your question back to could He have everything under control by using homosexuality as birth control. Just one of those rhetorical things that could go on forever. I just believe that every day people make choices, that in the end they have to make peace with themselves and thier Creator. I am not without sin, therefore who am I to stand in judgement of anyone else?

RandyLoo read my blog view my photos
Jun 3, 2008 | 10:14 PM

Aschelan I am not judging anyone, things of moral nature are left up to the individual, but that birth control thing just blew my mind. I don't think that is a good platform for gays and lesbians to use because it just doesn't make sense, especially today when birth control affords all sorts of methods.

aschelan read my blog view my photos
Jun 4, 2008 | 8:38 AM

Oh my goodness Randyloo, I never meant it to be a platform for anyone to use. When it was a topic of conversation I got into with someone that I work with, we spun the whole thing every which way.

And yes, there are many different forms of birth control, but some religions still frown on them being used. I was just tying the two things together.

Vittorio read my blog view my photos
Jun 4, 2008 | 8:46 AM

Birth control? I love it. Betcha the Creator saw the humor in it too.

RandyLoo read my blog view my photos
Jun 4, 2008 | 12:41 PM

OH, OK, quit laughing at me Vit! I am allowed a blond moment once or twice in my lifetime.

Vittorio read my blog view my photos
Jun 4, 2008 | 4:28 PM

I never laugh AT you. I respect your mind and your hair.

leasheryn read my blog
Jun 12, 2008 | 6:55 PM

Elk, it is impossible for a man to marry a man or a woman to marry a woman. Marriage is the joining together of a man and a woman in order to create a union. Where a union doesn't exist, a marriage CANNOT exist. Two men, or two women for that matter, do not have the correct components to join together in union, therefore no marriage.
This same sex marriage whooey is not about love and is not about marriage, it's about money and it's about benefits. It's about grasping and greed and these things are inconceivable when it comes to love and have no place in a marriage.

randythib read my blog view my photos
Jun 17, 2008 | 2:09 AM

i know some of you would prefer me to lie to a woman and ruin both our lives. i cannot live by society's agenda so i have decided to cultivate what others persecute me for. my partner and i are very happy, consenting, Christian, hard working tax payers and we WILL soon have equal rights that all others have. meanwhile, we have reciprocal wills and reciprocal durable powers of attorney so bible thumping idiots can't interfer with our wishes.

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elkahna

Long time area resident. Passionate about God, country, justice & motorcycles. Love spirited CLEAN debate and varying opinion.

Member Since: 5/1/2008